Virginia OOC assoc

[T244K27]

Nov 15, 2008 13:24:41 GMT -5 HardTimeTrucker said:

I understand many of you have received numerous phone calls from Virginia drivers over the past several months. I know we have a growing audience of drivers from Hampton Roads. We have many as guest browsing over our trucker forum while others make interesting post. That's why we added the Virginia ports section to our site months ago. For the past several weeks we have had an ear full along with several disturbing emails from Virginia drivers. It seems many truckers who haul from the ports in Norfolk feel they have no representation. Our association has been hesitant before acting because we know of the new group that started holding meetings this year. We were hoping to work with them but It seems they clearly are headed in a much different direction.

We planned from the beginning for this coalition of trucker groups to move forward toward a type of union representation, hiring hall, own union charter, or a possible charter affiliation by perhaps the International Longshoremen union. IODA no longer has any ties with the Teamsters because of their leadership involvement in the LA Clean Truck Plan. The majority of this group is made up from proud owner/operator truckers. We plan to continue our fight for both the right of freedom of ownership in America and that of (employee status). This association will not at any time be a part of any plan that bans the owner/operator from working anywhere. Taking away a citizens right to truck ownership is not the answer to any environmental pollution problems or any constructive means of solving issues of driver abuse at the port terminals. We are interested in serious driver / employee-lease/operator labor options to help truckers to win a workable contract within the maritime community.

First the trucker has to shed the ridicules industry backed - independent contractor status - before being recognized for what we truly are - employee-lease/operators. Without that recognition we have no rights under federal law to negotiate a contract with any employer no matter who the employer turns out to be.

According to several Virginia truckers a few board members of the Virginia based OOC group have stated they are somewhat anti-union. I hope this is not true but we respect that decision and that is an OOC leadership decision to make for their own membership. However, I'm afraid this attitude may limit the options of truckers who need much more than a smaller version of OOIDA to represent them on the waterfront.

We respect that as an OOC leadership decision. At the same time we do not condone censorship practice of participant ideas on any site. We don't hide that we are an organization that has close ties with the longshoremen workforce. Most of our membership work at the docks with them everyday. We understand that not every relation on the ground between the trucker and the long shore ends in a friendly exchange but the basics are in place where we all are working together to come up with a plan that will benefit members of both groups. Our group leadership has a respectful relationship with the International Longshoreman (ILWU & ILA) on both coast. This is especially true in the Norfolk, Virginia area.

As for the all the Virginia truckers (including OOC members or board members) who want to continue using this forum to educate themselves of choices they have, post their grievances, or even become a part of this association group we welcome you.

Thanks! We invite you as well. We have never contested the importance of working with the ILA. In fact, a meeting is in the works now with ILA reps from Washington D.C. I keep stating it is crucial that everyone align to promote progress.

It is important too , to us to be represented in various theaters. If not, you run the danger of being pigeonholed as "single platform" Overall , my point being that not ALL issues can be addressed through one singular action.


In regards to our forum, it wasn't the information that was posted that was of concern. It was the manner of which it was posted. I would not come to this forum as a guest and bomb the forum. If anyone here wants to post , by all means. The forum moderator saw multiple posts from different usernames all logging the same IP address. The posts were not done in a honest or respectful manner. Then , when the user was alerted to this, he began a negative media campaign. Come on? I would not do here what was done on our site.

Hope that helps.

[OOC]

Nov 15, 2008 13:41:17 GMT -5 shortcircut said:

I don't know what all has been said on the OOC site , but I do know this. Back in May a driver was talking about all the changes that were going to be made on the VIT run terminals. Like I said to him then, and will say it again now, no matter if he likes it or not, 40 drivers and 200 signatures will not make any difference, especially since there are over 130 companies and over 4000 drivers in this area.
If these guys want to be heard and taken seriously, then they had d**n well better start working on building their numbers. These VIT people will just laugh at them , then tell them, if you don't like it, then don't come back. And I am quoting some very powerful VIT people who told me that personally.
I for one want to see this problem solved , not for my self, but for everyone.
To confront someone and say that he needs to keep his negative remarks to him self is wrong. The first amendment guarantees that.
Instead of criticizing someone, listen to what they have to say, and find a way to use that to your benefit and try to figure answers to fix the problem that person is talking about.
Again, I can't control what anyone says or thinks, but if you don't like what I am saying , then walk away. I have a right to my opinion.

Our numbers are steadily growing. We have over 250 active members . While not all may come to a particular meeting , they are there. We work hard to grow the organization. It takes time.

Secondly, I attended OOIDA's board meeting out in Kansas in October. They have almost 1000 members in the Hampton Roads area. OOIDA has officially recognized the OOC and will be backing us with their resources.


VIT's willingness to address our concerns voluntarily can go either way. We certainly hope they will. If they don't we have the resources now to push the matter legally.


People have to understand, that even with large membership a group has to have resources. Legally, financially, educationally, etc. It's not an easy process.


Many drivers want something for nothing. They want to complain on the radio and
not lend a hand when it comes to participating.

I'll agree, but instead of stating negatives, understand that growth takes time. Any goals that are met by the OOC will help all of the drivers. Though there may be different platforms present , our community must be unified.

[petedabroker]

Related to policy on boards, members and their force, that is not something I pay much attention toward. I focus on truthful statements. Expression of idea's related to combating those who would like nothing better than to see the OO's turned into controlled robots. Its simply stated , not in their gene pool.

Related to the extra cost of drayage for empty positioned at another terminal. I been in this industry for 35 years and can state without a doubt the following is true.

If a shipper/exporter/freight forwarder/custom house broker was footing the bill, they would simply say, ok, how much more, then if they were the F/F or CHB would simply add that cost to the quoted price of the full dray, plus maybe $10.00 more for their company.

If its the shipper/importer alone, they would call one other, see they are charging the same and call you back and say ok, just add it to the invoice.

If it was the steamship lines, they would tell you , "YOUR CRAZY", hang up the phone and call another. Or if the Steamship Company owned the trucking company , they would tell the dispatcher to tell the drivers, some bull crap story to get them to haul it anyway for nothing more.

Those are the factual positions of each group that are involved in the trucking industry.

Now if it were the first group I was speaking about. The importer or exporter would call the lines, and say, hey, Evergreen, I don't get hit with that extra charge in the other Hampton Roads,Baltimore, or Savannah terminals, why am I having these extra expenses in Norfolk?

Well the port has determined that logistical move will actually save time. Importer say, " I don't pay for time now, I pay for extra moves".

Ok, Mr. Evergreen/ Norfolk, I am moving my freight to another terminal to avoid those extra cost of drayage.

Oh, No Mr. Shipper, don't do that, I will give you $50 off your existing ocean freight contract to make it all even again.

Now you are a talking Mr. Evergreen/Norfolk.

I know some truckers will bill it and others will shove it up the drivers butts once again. Let me tell you a little story here.

Back in the early 90's I made a decision to charge for over 1 hr. spent inside terminals. I put together a FSC table for all my customers. I lost over 35% of my business in one week. Drivers were going nuts because of my business move. Freight was way down.
MY shippers who left would call and say , I want to give you my business, but the other carriers are not charging me for such. I said, well I guess you will go with the other carriers, but if with me , you will be paying me and my drivers for those extra cost.
They would say, well AB&C is not charging me. I would say , well use them. But they don't have any trucks to make the move. I would say then use me and I can move the cargo.

Not more than two weeks went by and many of my drivers showed up at my window, with a copy of BTT new rate schedule. Guess what ? They were charging for time and FSC, at the exact same amount as me. Then one by one, all started to charge. All was once again equal, and all were benefiting from that additional expense , now being paid for it. Yes, I still lost some business, but guess what? The ones who left were the slowest of pay and always complained no matter how well they were treated, and I got more business that paid better and was grateful to have a good trucker handling there business. That is the real world. It takes one guy to put his foot in the water first.

[HardTimeTrucker]

Thanks! We invite you as well. We have never contested the importance of working with the ILA. In fact, a meeting is in the works now with ILA reps from Washington D.C. I keep stating it is crucial that everyone align to promote progress.

If you want to work with us we can arrange that for you. In the meantime the makeup of our board (and we will leave it at that for now) have been working with people in this industry for well over thirty years on all sides of the harbor.. We wish you the best with your meeting with the ILA, but for your future info the only ILA in Washington, DC is their government affairs department. The ILA has no reps. There are actually ILA on this list serve. We have many other concerned industry folk who would like to see a more stabilized workforce in intermodal trucking. It's not only for our benefit as a owner/driver but that of everyone including the shippers to develop a better terminal system. To do that everyone understands the standard of living must be raised to support a more stable transportation workforce.

[OOC]

Nov 15, 2008 14:29:38 GMT -5 petedabroker said:

Related to policy on boards, members and their force, that is not something I pay much attention toward. I focus on truthful statements. Expression of idea's related to combating those who would like nothing better than to see the OO's turned into controlled robots. Its simply stated , not in their gene pool.

Related to the extra cost of drayage for empty positioned at another terminal. I been in this industry for 35 years and can state without a doubt the following is true.

If a shipper/exporter/freight forwarder/custom house broker was footing the bill, they would simply say, ok, how much more, then if they were the F/F or CHB would simply add that cost to the quoted price of the full dray, plus maybe $10.00 more for their company.

If its the shipper/importer alone, they would call one other, see they are charging the same and call you back and say ok, just add it to the invoice.

If it was the steamship lines, they would tell you , "YOUR CRAZY", hang up the phone and call another. Or if the Steamship Company owned the trucking company , they would tell the dispatcher to tell the drivers, some bull crap story to get them to haul it anyway for nothing more.

Those are the factual positions of each group that are involved in the trucking industry.

Now if it were the first group I was speaking about. The importer or exporter would call the lines, and say, hey, Evergreen, I don't get hit with that extra charge in the other Hampton Roads,Baltimore, or Savannah terminals, why am I having these extra expenses in Norfolk?

Well the port has determined that logistical move will actually save time. Importer say, " I don't pay for time now, I pay for extra moves".

Ok, Mr. Evergreen/ Norfolk, I am moving my freight to another terminal to avoid those extra cost of drayage.

Oh, No Mr. Shipper, don't do that, I will give you $50 off your existing ocean freight contract to make it all even again.

Now you are a talking Mr. Evergreen/Norfolk.

I know some truckers will bill it and others will shove it up the drivers butts once again. Let me tell you a little story here.

Back in the early 90's I made a decision to charge for over 1 hr. spent inside terminals. I put together a FSC table for all my customers. I lost over 35% of my business in one week. Drivers were going nuts because of my business move. Freight was way down.
MY shippers who left would call and say , I want to give you my business, but the other carriers are not charging me for such. I said, well I guess you will go with the other carriers, but if with me , you will be paying me and my drivers for those extra cost.
They would say, well AB&C is not charging me. I would say , well use them. But they don't have any trucks to make the move. I would say then use me and I can move the cargo.

Not more than two weeks went by and many of my drivers showed up at my window, with a copy of BTT new rate schedule. Guess what ? They were charging for time and FSC, at the exact same amount as me. Then one by one, all started to charge. All was once again equal, and all were benefiting from that additional expense , now being paid for it. Yes, I still lost some business, but guess what? The ones who left were the slowest of pay and always complained no matter how well they were treated, and I got more business that paid better and was grateful to have a good trucker handling there business. That is the real world. It takes one guy to put his foot in the water first.

Ill agree. This should absolutely be a billable item. The problem is that the motor carriers will not push the issue. A few tried a couple years ago and they are all out of business. If some try now, one will come along and say they "won't charge" to gain the added business.

We are working also on the "free labor " issue with M&R oversight. Owner operators are not contractually binded to do this. Furthermore, most of the universal interchange agreements don't even list the motor Carrier as Liable.
As a said before, we are gaining ground on this one. It too, will require some motor carriers to step up and bill for our labor, then make sure they pass the pay to us.


With this particular circumstance regarding empty relocation, its a tough call. Even if compensation were to be initiated, it couldn't possibly be enough to cover the added time. Turn times stink already, and if that passes , the time will be doubled , also there is the bobtail issue. So, any added moneys would not be enough to cover the fact you lose so much working time. That would cost drivers 1-2 rounds a day. Compensation , if it were to happen would not be enough to cover that must lost pay. It just introduces too much cost across the board.


For now, we can't let that happen. The owner operators will simply lose too much.

[OOC]

Nov 15, 2008 15:05:27 GMT -5 HardTimeTrucker said:

Thanks! We invite you as well. We have never contested the importance of working with the ILA. In fact, a meeting is in the works now with ILA reps from Washington D.C. I keep stating it is crucial that everyone align to promote progress.

If you want to work with us we can arrange that for you. In the meantime the makeup of our board (and we will leave it at that for now) have been working with people in this industry for well over thirty years on all sides of the harbor.. We wish you the best with your meeting with the ILA, but for your future info the only ILA in Washington, DC is their government affairs department. The ILA has no reps. There are actually ILA on this list serve. We have many other concerned industry folk who would like to see a more stabilized workforce in intermodal trucking. It's not only for our benefit as a owner/driver but that of everyone including the shippers to develop a better terminal system. To do that everyone understands the standard of living must be raised to support a more stable transportation workforce.

The gov't affairs dept. is to whom I was referring. Being that the Port is state owned and its officials are chosen by Politicians.... You see where I am going?

[carolinaboy]

There will continue to be plenty of free labor sources without securing any binding contract between the parties involved. How many times have we heard this political fix-all over the years. I have been moving these boxes since 1977. It's fine to use the political system at times to reach a specific goal. At the same time remember the process is so slow and corrupt that we will all be dead before you see a third of the results everyone out here needs now. Think you can out contribute these shippers and retailers in their donations to government officials? When deregulation hit that opened the door for any stupid moron to become a trucking company. Without a binding contract there will always be someone cheaper to do the work. We used to get paid for M&R when it started going to that. We got paid for the stack operation when the mounts dismounts started. Every single thing extra we have done at the port all started out with being paid. Now look where we are. These companies are hungry and there are plenty of newbie drivers everyday. The only thing that has saved us from being replaced by illegals over the next year is enforcement of the TWIC card about to take place. There will always be some motor carrier that will start the undercutting feeding frenzies out here. Don't think any of this has been tried before? Just talk to some of the older hands out in the port but you won't find many left. We need to empower ourself with a binding contract like the longshoremen have that spells out in detail what our job services are along with what pay to expect. I spoke a couple months ago with a driver who owns his truck leased to a Florida company under union contract. He told me the ILA has over five hundred owner operator truckers in Florida who are current union members leased to several different motor carriers down there. So there are ways this can be done.

[petedabroker]

OOC, Paul,

I have been at the table with the Steamship Lines. Myself and a gentleman named Bill D.I.C.K.Ens were awarded two seats at the Steamship Trade Association meetings in Baltimore, only after a three day strike at the port. Maersk/Sealand handed us cease and desist order, and the Federal Trade Commission threatened actions against our group. They accepted our three demands before the meeting. One was two seats, one was a meeting with the Feds, and the other was an absolute contact at the terminal , when delays were past one hour and driver was not being served. We got the seats as I stated, we got the meeting with the Feds, and we got a live body with a cell phone to help drivers along at the terminals.

Meeting first- S/S Lines position was to try to work on at least five turns per driver. I said, you worry about the terminal operations and drivers will worry about how fast/how many they can turn. Now here is what I want to see at the pier. I want containers mounted on good wheels , ready to go upon arrival. To make that all work I propose this. As a carrier I receive a delivery order from the broker. I call the terminal to assure both steamship and custom release has been completed. If both done, next I call the line the day before, but 11am to arrange mounting. If my appointment are good, meaning enough wheels exist, I show up with my drivers, pick up the loads and leave. If I fail to show you build into the interchange agreement terms that state I am responsible to pay $100/day for chassis mount ordered and not used. On the other hand , if I show and containers are not mounted I bill you $100 for truck ordered and not used. Boy you should of heard all that yelling going on. Like:
Who in the hell do you think you are? We don't have enough chassis to handle all those orders. Your crazy for asking.

I said, gentleman, you just answered the million dollar question and finally answered it honestly, "You do not have enough chassis for all our moves". Then why in the hell make us wait at the terminal for chassis that are not available? That is exactly my problem here. So you have two choices, buy more chassis, or get out of the chassis business all together and let me come in with my own. The key here is that all truckers are equal then. We all need to buy our own chassis and charge our customers for their use, or lease and charge our customers for that bill, but by doing this, you made all truckers equal. All have the same cost.

You know that in all other ports all over the world, not one line supplies chassis to the truckers. All the truckers have their own chassis. If the lines are doing such a terrible job supplying chassis, then move over and let the trucking industry do it for them. Ask yourself this very important question. Why are so many chassis sitting at the terminal in disrepair, until the trucker hooks and is told to move it to the M&R lines for repair? Because the ILA has no contract to supply this service anymore. It was negotiated away. We got that responsibility and without reenumeration's over all these years. Just like the prior post to mine said, all moves years ago were billed and paid for by the trucking company, and I mean all. Wheels over at leasing company, no problem $75.00 stop off charge. Take container to one terminal , then wheels to another, no problem, $75.00 stop off charge. I loved those kinds of moves. Quick in, Quick outs, better than the line haul and no free time needed. I billed my clients for those moves, and to my knowledge, since I am retired, my old firm still does bill. Remember I never took, not one, door to door steamship routed container. Not one. Never. Ever.
I saw what they did to another firm I worked for before starting my own trucking business. He would sweat bullets getting paid. Yes, sir, can you check and see if you paid my 120 day invoices. Screw those lines. I don't kiss anyones a.s.s. for my own money.

That my friend was the start of this whole industry demise. Route Coded Containers. Once the Steamship lines got into our industry, we may as well bent over and kissed it all goodbye. I saw my old boss, hand carry TV sets to the line managers in Jersey to get more business. I saw with my own eyes him on the phone begging for his money. Please sir, I need to make payroll this week. Only half , I can't live like this. STEAMSHIP COMPANIES ARE ALL SCUM!!!!!!!!

So who do you work with at the ports? The port officials? They do nothing, they rent space to the lines or stevedoring firms, landlords is all they are. So who do you want us all to work with? Only ones left is the steamship companies. The stevedoring firms have no say so, they work for the steamship companies. ILA works for the stevedoring companies. So all that is left and at the top of this heap is the Steamship Companies. Politicians? Oh, they are the guys and gals who get election funds from the Steamship Companies, so do you really believe they will take our side on this fence. Paul, they are kidding you , if you don't already realize it. You will be played. All your members will be played. They are experts at playing games. Buddy, its us against them in this arena, short and sweet , us against them. Been there , done that, too many times to count.
Oh, getting back to the progress made with our two seats. That lasted for one meeting, then we were barred. The meeting at the FTC resulted in them saying, boy , those guys are really screwing the hell out of you, but as I said, you are OO's and cannot call strikes and if you do it again, we will have you arrested. Guy with the phone lasted two weeks, then it all went back to the exact way it was. End of this story. Regards,
Peter

[shortcircut]

well, I know about the complaining on the CB, I heard it almost daily. Now I don't bother wasting my time turning it on. When I did talk on it, I repeatedly said the drivers need to come together as one group and stand up for themselves. I can tell you one d**n thing, it wasn't me complaining on the CB. I am paid by the hour so I really don't care how long it takes to get through the ports. I do how ever think that the drivers need to be paid for their time, and if they aren't smart enough to stand up for them selves , then the are getting just what they deserve.
Don't cry and gripe about the lines , then do nothing about it. grow some balls

[petedabroker]

Shortcircut, just what do you think this site is all about? That is it's sole purpose to unite drivers under one voice, one direction. Your one of the lucky ones my man. Every OO here would like to get paid per hour, but no junk hour pay. We are talking real money here.
$58/hr, plus truck pay, plus overtime, plus handling, plus full benefits,plus FSC if applicable, and with every click of the clock, money drops into our meters. Cha ching, cha ching, cha ching. One objective at a time, first to kill the California Teamster backed bull crap bowl out there. Then the whole team heads to the locker room for a good pep talk and back out onto the field for a good work out. Then the super bowl. There days a coming.

[shortcircut]

I know , but , I do want to be an Owner Operator again. The problem in this area is people just talk , then turn around and say " what can we do, nothing . that is what.
Well I for one have done things to make a difference. I will do things again. Soem of the drivers have seen what I am capable of. Back in the spring of 03 , a female driver and myself organized a little rallye outside of PMT . Maybe it is time to do it again. This crap of the long lines and lanes getting closed because of ILA layoffs , is BS.
As far as these guys doing all of this organizing here and doing it by their self, that has to stop. We need the help of other area , the reason being, with out every one working together , these ship lines will move to other ports and just bypass this area.
Yes these guys have a lawyer, and yes the have people coming to meetings, although not very many , and not many of the older drivers who have been in the industry for many years ( myself only 14 years) . They need to listen what is going on in other area, contact other area , and work with them.
These guys think it is just Hampton roads is all that matters, wake up people , we can easily be pushed aside

[shortcircut]

I went back and read some of the previous posts. Paul from the OOC said that numerous post were made from different IP addresses( what ever that is ) but were the same person. who cares, what is this kindergarden ? d**n , people have a right to their opinions , and though we may not all agree, let people speak their mind.. Diversity is what has made this world survive.
Not all one person speaking the same words over and over.
The only choice we really have is to come together. If we do not, we will continue to get ran over by the carriers and the SSlines.
This includes people from other areas as well

[willmingtontrucker]

This is exactly why I like returning to this site each week. Very little censorship by the board CZAR Hardtimetrucker and plenty of raw meat. Let ur rip guys and gals. I tell you this is the best d**n web for truckers who work the ports in America. I have learned more here than the last nine years wasted listening to everyone at this port terminal trying to figure it out. Pete your great even when you bounce off on your soapbox in another direction that we don't really follow it still continues to be a learning experience. The rest of your crew is too.I love to see our dispatcher go to cursing you guys out over his morning coffee. We have told him to quit looking at the site so he can manage his blood pressure and then he really explodes. No one made much trouble at our barn til a few of us started reading this stuff. Now the whole crew is looking at this and jacking them up. I think what we have heard so far of the way you guys view what should be done is where we should be headed. You got my vote.

[shortcircut]

I am glad there is a site like this. One that people can express their thoughts and ideas , without a bunch of children trying to control what is being said. One that people can put out their ideas and people will listen , open their minds to other possibilities , and give their opinions and everyone try to work together , not controll everything.
The OOC guys may control their website, but they will not control the people who can think for them selves.

[OOC]

Nov 16, 2008 9:18:44 GMT -5 shortcircut said:

I am glad there is a site like this. One that people can express their thoughts and ideas , without a bunch of children trying to control what is being said. One that people can put out their ideas and people will listen , open their minds to other possibilities , and give their opinions and everyone try to work together , not controll everything.
The OOC guys may control their website, but they will not control the people who can think for them selves.

Mr Barham,


For the TENTH TIME! There is NO censorship on our forum. GET it right. First off, an IP address is a like a "telephone number' for your computer. When you post in a forum it is visible to the moderator. When you violate the rules and make multiple posts with various registered user names it is called SPAMMING! The deletion was due to that and not the content of the post. Not because someone voiced their opinion, not because we agree or disagree, because the rules were broken.


Grow up!

You post as if we are trying to control people who think? Give me a break. You can launch a negative BS media campaign all you want. Talk about unity and working together, well start with yourself.


There is nothing wrong with this forum or the host website. SO , people need to stop trying to put a "twist" on what happened.

[shortcircut]

if any one needs to grow up it is you not a very nice person. first, I don't go posting names, second, I don't go calling people on their personal phones and accuse them of things. Third, if you want to have a face to face conversation, then do it. I didn't start the accusations of censorship, I did however talk with people who posted on your site, so I do know for a fact that you do. So shut up. you can't back up your lies on this site.

[shortcircut]

and by the way, I didn't use the phrase (not a very nice person). I am sure if you look on your lists , you can find my number on their, call me and I will tell you the exact phrase I did use

[OOC]

Nov 16, 2008 15:23:01 GMT -5 shortcircut said:

and by the way, I didn't use the phrase (not a very nice person). I am sure if you look on your lists , you can find my number on their, call me and I will tell you the exact phrase I did use

First off, it wasn't I that called you. Second, if you are going to post some B/S I am going to call you out on it. Third , I don't care who you talked to. It is a common practice to have alerts to possible spam content on sites. You guys wanna post about what goes on here, by all means. Just follow the rules, and don't to things to be deceitful. It's that simple. I can't figure why its so hard to grasp that its not about the content. Someone can post as much as they wish, whatever they wish. If they create multiple user ID's and post the same thing over and over, the spam filter will alert the moderator and the post will be deleted.


People should have gained clarification on this before they jump to conclusions and begin posting things like "we are in the pocket of the industry" which is very far from the truth.


It's that simple. I put my name out there because I have nothing to hide , nor is what I am saying false. SO, if you don't want to be called out, don't make false accusations and try to discredit an organization that works hard to help all owner operators.

You personally have done nothing but be negative since day one. If you don't want to help, fine. But don't do things to be hurtful etc. It is truly a show of ones character.


Cheers.

[petedabroker]

Gentleman, please so kind to accept ones views. I have not read one thing from either of you that was done in malaise. Bickering back and forth will never add to the solution here. You both are right, both have opinions, both are pro OO's. Sometimes one never sees the persons face, consequently their true meaning is lost. That has always been a problem with email. If you both were speaking together you would walk away shaking hands. If their site is edited or if its not, does not really matter? Folks have the ability to visit and stay or move onto another. Paul says its not, and he is the moderator, and if he says he does not, then take him at his word. If you know differently, then just don't go to the site. I never visited their site, so I cannot say anything about it. I am happy here and will stay here, and welcome all comments as being constructive. I am not trying to tell you what to do, but can we focus our attention on the problems without making more? Now shake each others hands, pat on the back and call it even. Life is just to short. Just a suggestion, not meaning any harm. If you have a desire to continue your conversation, might I suggest that Hardtimetrucker, make up another section called differences, and let you guys converse there. I just don't want to give the Virginia haulers a bad taste here. Again nothing meant to harm. Peter

[shortcircut]

Pete, I didn't start this thread , nor did I post multiple remarks on their site. To be totally honest, I don't think they are going in the right direction, so I decided to just ignore their ignorance. I just found out Friday night that they had a site, but instead of joing their site, I chose to join this one.
Apperently from what I have read here , they want to control anything posted on their site and that is fine. It just tells everyone what kind of mentality that we as a group have to deal with.
H*ll , if it wasn't for Jim Stewart and myself, those clowns would still probably know nothing about filing for a charter. I have been to several of their meeting , and all they are is crying sessions.
I hope the local drivers can see through all their BS and see the bigger picture.
If all I did was speak negative, then why did they ask me to speak at their meeting , and why did Paul want to meet with Jim Stewart , and NOT include the Vice President of the OOC ?

[shortcircut]

Hey Pete, what is going on down in Savannah. I have been hearing alot of roumors but, no one has really let us know up here how things are really going. Are they still planning on activating the TWIC badges on Dec. 1st. ?
I have been trying to check on the status of my application for one and all that I can find out is that the TWIC system crashed and that they don't know when it will be approved.

[petedabroker]

Again, this cannot be confirmed by me or this site, but I hear that most if not all drivers, on December 1st, 2008 will service their equipment on that day. Some have even suggested a little party, to enjoy talk about union unity, how great the day is, how big the children are getting, etc, etc., so for all the scabs out there, I guess December 1st, should be a good day to prove how much a pimple on the a.s.s. of the trucking industry you really are, while getting your good for one day pay.

TWIC, I heard it crashed, its been just under a month and my card has yet to arrive. It even went out the day I was making application for about three hours. Maybe others here can better update you on the status of TWIC and related problems.

[shortcircut]

Yeah, I have HazMat so I am sure getting my ID will not be a problem, but , time is definitely becoming an issue. We are still( as far as I know) scheduled to begin enforcement on Jan 13th.

[shortcircut]

maybe, since the flu has been going around so bad, maybe all of the Savannah drivers will be getting their flu shots on the first. boy, that would be one hell of a line wouldn't it ?

[pkd5757]

Hey OOC, I'm Paul from Boston and I didn't sign on with any other computer but my own. I posted a message on your site to draw out some conversation and let your members know about how things have worked up here in Boston. I joined your forum and had my message deleted on Saturday. Today I tried to sign on and couldn't. YOU DELETED ME!!!!! Thanks, my IP address must be the same as someone else. No wait, you inferred that's not possible! Maybe you just didn't like my point of view. There are many ideas out here among O/O's, some may be different than mine. That doesn't make mine better or worse than yours, that's for all the O/O's to decide. I've been working this idea of unity amongst the O/O's for a long time now and I do it only because it's the right thing to do. Not because I want to be in charge or make anyone do it my way. Let the drivers speak, sometimes you'll like what they say and sometimes you won't. We can learn from each other, but only when we listen! Thanks for the DELETE! Paul from Boston